Wednesday, November 7, 2012
From Book Two, Chapter IX
Neither, as she approached her old home now, did any of the best influences of old home descend upon her. The dreams of childhood -- its airy fables, its graceful, beautiful, humane, impossible adornments of the world beyond: so good to be believed in once, so good to be remembered when out-grown, for then the least among them rises to the stature of a great Charity in the heart, suffering little children to come into the midst of it, and to keep with their pure hands a garden in the stony ways of this world, wherein it were better for all the children of Adam that they should oftener sun themselves, simple and trustful, and not worldly-wise -- what had she to do with these? Remembrances of how she had journeyed to the little that she knew, by the enchanted roads of what she and millions of innocent creatures had hoped and imagined; of how, first coming upon Reason through the tender light of Fancy, she had seen it a beneficent god, deferring to gods as great as itself: not a grim Idol, cruel and cold, with its victims bound hand to foot, and its big dumb shape set up with a sightless stare, never to be moved by anything, but so many calculated tons of leverage -- what had she to do with these? Her remembrances of home and childhood were remembrances of the drying up of every spring and fountain in her young heart as it gushed out. The golden waters were not there. They were flowing for the fertilization of the land where grapes are gathered from thorns, and figs from thistles.
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This is an interesting paragraph, because it reflects on the importance of our childhood. Our childhood is one of the most important stages in our lives even if our adulthood may turn out different. It is important, because the memories are always there even if when we encounter them because of how our adulthood experiences has shaped us. It is always there and when we look back to it, we get a sense of melancholy. The only difference is that as adults we learn that what we believed in as children is not quite true. We learn that the real world is not a fairy tale with happy endings.
ReplyDeleteWhile I don't want to drift too far away from a specific discussion of Dickens, I do think Mirianda raises a really good question here that we can apply to Dickens. If the real world is not a fairy tale (and clearly there is a lot of evidence in Dickens that he knows this to be true), why is it so important to Dickens that childhood be a time of fairy tales? Be as specific as possible in considering this (particular characters, their lives and their outcomes, etc.)
ReplyDeleteI think its important to Dickens that childhood be a time of fairy tales because the realities of day to day life is too harsh for children and especially children of the lower income class. For instance Sissy lives most of her life in a circus fairy tale. The only time she gets a glimpse of reality is when she travels through the ghetto to get to school and even in he classroom she's sort of caste off and separated because of her socio-economic indifference.
DeleteI agree with Mirianda's comment about childhood. I think although Dickens shows the harsh realities of poverty amongst children, he still manages to express a sense of care free child-like aspects in his stories. For example, in Oliver Twist we saw how although Oliver was an orphan and living a life of poverty, he still experienced adventure and escape. We can see the child in all of us most times, and I think that may be something to think about when reading Dickens. We have a fun child-like aspect to our lives, yet reality of society will always be there no matter how we try to go around it or avoid it. Still in yet, I think Dickens strives for that sense of childhood and innocence. I would really like to discuss this topic of innocence vs. reality.
DeleteChildhood should be a time of fairy tales because in life it is the only chance that a person can ever come close to living ome.
DeleteDickens implies that for children life should be a fairy tale because once you are of age, your responsibilities and the way you have come to view the world no longer allow you to live in such a naive way.
We see this with the Gradgrind children.
This passage shows how important it is to allow children to explore their imaginations and to be brought up on fairy tales and dreams. In this passage it is clear that Dickens believes child's imagination is vital in developing a child's character and that an imagination can serve as the glue that can hold an individual together. Tom Gradgrind and Louisa Gradgrind were deprived of fairy tales and the chance to explore their imagination and as a result they are unhappy and incomplete as people. In this passage Dickens calls the imagination of child as " a great charity of the heart" and states that it great to have believe in it once. Both Tom and Louisa never had that charity so it proved difficult for them to endure in the real world and they give up on it. A childhood full of fairy tales were suppose to instill an individual with hope and that would hope drive individuals but Tom and Louisa do not have that hope. Without that hope they had little to live for.
ReplyDeleteI completely agree that the arguement here is pro fantasy/imagination when it comes to a child developing in a positive manner. Without this imagination aka golden waters, you have to face real problems like thorns and thistles.
DeleteIt would also appear for Dickens that reason comes after fancy and imagination when the narrator states, "first coming upon Reason through the tender light of Fancy." It would also seem that reason should not be used in the way that Thomas Gradgrind sr. uses it. It should not be cold and cruel, but used as a guide along with the imagination. Both imagination and reason should be used together.
ReplyDelete"Her remembrances of home and childhood were remembrances of the drying up of every spring and fountain in her young heart as it gushed out. The golden waters were not there. They were flowing for the fertilization of the land where grapes are gathered from thorns, and figs from thistles." It seems that she can no longer relish in the thoughts of what it was like to be young and the youthful pleasures that go along with the nostalgia of her youth. Her heart was now flowing the power of hope and childhood fantasies that can lead to the manifestation of a dream, towards the many poor and heartbroken people of the city. Prehaps the creative power of the childhood fantasy could cause have a transforming effect upon the world around her if this thought, this imaginative power could move from inside of her, germinate into a thought inside of other people and change the world around them. After all, the world as we know it today, high tech and full of gadgets mimicked the dreams of many of children who played games of talking to each other through imaginary portals and gadgets. Or prehaps, this passage is telling us that as she looks at the world around her that her heart is pouring out its hopes and dreams into a land where, her hopes are fertilizing a barren land of thorns, thistles and where there is no growth. Yet, fruits are coming from forth or can come forth from such a barreness.
ReplyDeleteYou'd think the overall message of Fancy over fact would be getting a little stale by now, but somehow it isn't. Dickens abhors fact and wallows in the imagination- we all know this by now, and if you don't, shame on you! This passage highlights those very opinions once again, but manages to acknowledge the sympathy we should have for Louisa, and all children who lack or may have lacked the artistic childhoods that come with a strong imagination and being free of obligation.
ReplyDeleteThe passage's first two sentences struck me most. A homeward bound journey should be a happy time, to reminisce on youthful memories; this is not the case for Louisa. Dickens reminds us that her unfortunate upbringing of fact superseding Fancy has ground (GradGRIND) the very life out of her. The "airy fables, graceful, beautiful, humane, [and] impossible adornments of the world beyond..." remain absent from Louisa's life.
We know how much Dickens values a place to call home. When things get tough in the real world, a good home provides shelter and comfort. Oliver (Oliver Twist) left his home with nary a look back. Louisa's desperation is so extreme, she returns to the very place that trampled all over her ingenuousness. It's depressing.
When Professor asked the question why is it so important to allow children to indulge essentially in fancy, I couldn't help but think of present day society. Christmas is coming up and as adults we know that Santa Claus is a figment of a child's imagination, yet we encourage our children (some not all) to believe such fables. Disney is a profitable establishment built on fairy tales. ( I digress) I brought up those instances to say that a child's imagination is linked to a prolonged innocence, it provides hope for a future they may or may not be exposed to, not to mention it allows for creativity, and where would the world be without creativity.
ReplyDeleteOh and one other thing. Allowing a child to indulge in fancy when young, allows for the individual that is now an adult to empathize and sympathize with children who suffer.
ReplyDeleteThis passage is definitely very rich and one of the best I have read in the novel. We can clearly see how Dickens's writing has shifted from a journalistic approach into a more vivid and poetic style.
ReplyDeleteMany of my fellow classmates have highlighted the main points of the passage, mainly the suffering of Louisa, and how her childhood had been full of facts and clearly lacked any imagination. Because of this reason, I cannot help but think that Dickens is making a Biblical reference to the story of Adam and Eve. Following her "fall," Louisa remembers her sad childhood. Like all the "children of Adam," she had been "simple" and "trustful", but not "worldly-wise". The question then comes: "what had she to do with these?". Louisa's encounter with Harthouse marks her fall and allows her to gain the knowledge that she was not able to gain as a child.
There is no doubt that Dickens is criticizing Gradgrind's method of raising his children, but is he also suggesting that it is okay for women like Louisa to be "worldly-wise", even if it cause them to fall?
Wow, I like all of the comments so much. I love Sean's point that childhood is the time when character (SO important to Dickens, as you shall be reminded at the New York Public Library exhibit) is developed, when your heart essentially grows. I also like the discussion between Greg, Troy and Ibrahim about how this will all end. Can you have a childhood like Louisa's (and Tom's) and recover? If so how/why? Can you "gather grapes from thorns" as Gregory suggests or do you find this passage, as Troy does, depressing? Is what is important here that childhood breeds creativity, and, as Christina suggests, we need creativity to help solve our problems? On another note, since poor people can have childhoods not governed by fact (the circus "family") is this time of character-building somehow an equal-opportunity time? A building block of a just society? Last but not least, Ibrahim makes an excellent observation that Dickens's language is becoming more poetic and less journalistic. Do you agree? This is also something to keep in mind as you move onto GREAT EXPECTATIONS.
ReplyDeleteYet again we return to the idea of fact vs. fancy, and the new twist is how childhood meshes with this debate. According to the passage "the dreams of childhood-its airy fables, its graceful, beautiful, humane, impossible adornments of the world beyond..." fancy is a component of childhood yet there is an part of the overall text (Mr. Gradgrind) that would argue that this is not the correct way. The question then becomes, is fancy a part of childhood or is it an unnecessary component that simply sends the individual off-course in a world that is governed by facts. There is a level of ambiguity in these lines that leaves me wondering if the world has room for both fact and fancy, or if you must choose only one.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Joe in the fact vs. fancy topic and how it relates to this passage. It goes along well with my first comment under Mirianda and Professor Reitz's comments where I mentioned innocence vs. reality when it comes to Dickens's approach to childhood. Joe raises a good question on whether the world has room for both fact and fancy, or if we must choose only one. Personally I believe there is room for both, but I don't believe they hold equal value in every situation or at every time. I think most times one will overpower the other. By the end of reading Hard Times, I would definitely like to think about which one overpowers the other because right now I find that reality/fact is holding a stronger position, but I know this can easily change as we continue to read.
DeleteAs Professor Reitz said, I really enjoyed reading all you guys comments. Always after reading Gregory's comment I am schooled to a new way of thinking about this passage, that which is great. In this passage I see Dickens's shift from his prosy voice which is usually an indication of his advocacy, to a poetic voice. Within this passage Dickens's poetic voice does two specific things, the first is to explain in a more colorful way the importance of a child experiencing "fancy" during their childhood and the effects if they do not. The second point that Dickens's poetic voice makes is to show off his writing skills as well as to show his reader that although poetry may represent "fancy" with its colorful nature, the fact still remains that it has a very specific message that is based on "fact." This means that a person can actually learn from poetry.
ReplyDeleteDickens uses the garden as a metaphor for a person’s mental life span from childhood to adulthood. When Dickens mentions “stony ways of this world” he is referring to the outside influence a person is exposed to; like Louisa being taught by her father that facts are the only thing that matter. But Dickens believes a child should “keep with their pure hands a garden in the stony ways of this world wherein it were better for all the children of Adam that they should oftener sun themselves, simple and trustful, and not worldly-wise.” Even though a person lives within this stony world they should not let the outside world dictate their thoughts and emotions. They should have the freedom and independence to tend to their garden/ideology, shedding their own light/outlook upon it. By a person tending to their own garden/ideology they will grow up and flourish into a happy independent person. But “what had [Louisa] to do with these?”, nothing.
ReplyDeleteHer garden/mental and emotional state is “drying up of every spring and fountain in her young heart as it gushed out. The golden waters were not there. They were flowing for the fertilization of the land where grapes are gathered from thorns, and figs from thistles.” This causes Louisa to grow up into a dependent, unstable, confused woman. Her garden may have grapes and figs representing wealth, which is indeed what she and her brother need, but the fruits are a false notion of a happy life since thorns and thistles come along with them. The thorns and thistles represent her sad life being married to Bounderby.
Louisa returning to her old home, where the seed of her life was planted, she realizes her father manipulated the cause of her woeful life’s outcome there. A person’s thoughts, imaginations and emotions are what a person has one hundred percent control over and Louisa was robbed of that privilege.
Dickens mentions childhood is like a fairy tale to lighten up the mood. Although he describes childhood as a fairytale, in reality it is not. Children face sickness, struggle and death just like adults do. Next, Dickens mentions a garden to symbolize life. Life is fruitful and progressive. However ,"thorns and figs from thistles" are obstacles of life. Louisa represents the fruit but however the thorns are a symbol of her struggles piercing her as she tries to grow.
ReplyDeleteIt is important to Dickens that childhood is a time of fairy tales because the experiences that one have as a child helps to guide and shape their adulthood interpretations. As a result, childhood years are vulnerable years. This makes it important for children to be surrounded with happiness and love. These are main things that most fairytales teaches. Adults have to be able to identify pure love and happiness to avoid accepting a miserable life as a normal life. Mrs. Gradgrind falls under the category of an adult who is unable to differentiate between living a miserable life and accepting it is normal from living a truly happy life. This is proven through her relationship with Mr. Gradgrind. She allows Mr. Gradgrind to wed their young daughter to a much older man because of the facts of their relations. They believe that love is unimportant in marriages. It is safe to assume that Mrs. Gradgrind once married for similar reasons. The circus family embodies the notion of love and happiness in family. This is shown by the deep concern they have for each other and through the way they defend each other. Also, through Sissy, who is the product of their rearing. Sissy is quite the opposite of, Louisa and Tom Gradgrind, who are unable to function in the world without their parents rule. They are aware that their childhood, without love and happiness, as affected their adulthood and this becomes their downfalls.
ReplyDeleteWow, amazing discussion!
ReplyDeleteI just want to add to some of what Sean had pointed out; Dickens believes that both fact and fancy work together and too much of either may be detrimental. As most of us have mentioned, children should relish the brief time they have to explore and cultivate their imaginations, but there will come a point when they encounter fact and reason. People mature having in their memories those times that contained the “airy fables” and “impossible adornments” and these make life, with its thorns and hardships, live-able. Louisa is represented as a character who never had this childhood to fall back on and this realization is depressing, as Troy mentions. We also learn in Book Three that a certain entrepreneur (Spoiler: Bounderby) dwells excessively in his fancy, a fiction that is extended into his later years, which would also be really sad if it was not for his unbelievable arrogance (we still feel for his mother though). In contrast to these characters we have Sissy, a character who maintains her gaiety despite her father leaving her and living in the Gradgrind house for an extended period, to the benefit of the Gradgrinds. Having had a “fanciful” childhood she was prepared for the facts, suggesting that there is a balance to be maintained between the two.
"The dreams of childhood -- its airy fables, its graceful, beautiful, humane, impossible adornments of the world beyond: so good to be believed in once, so good to be remembered when out-grown, for then the least among them rises to the stature of a great Charity in the heart." Dickens does a great job at describing the importance of childhood in a very poetic way. Imagination and fancy shape a child's character in the future and most importantly, they create a sense of compassion in them as adults. Childhood is the one time when both rich and poor can get to be equal, they are unaware of social classes and the harsh realities of the world. Their lives are governed by fancy and fables which describe life as always having a happy ending no matter where you come from, instilling a sense of optimism and equality in each and every one of us. That is what makes childhood so essential.
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ReplyDeleteFrom Phylicia Grant: "When I read the passage, Dickens's choice of words stood out to me the most. His choice of words were cleverly chosen to strengthen what I believe his point is-- that a child hood filled with only facts isn't a bright, happy childhood at all. For example, Dickens writes:"Her remembrances of home and childhood were remembrances of the drying up of every spring and fountain in her young heart as it gushed out", here, Dickens shows how boring, dull, and grim a childhood without fancy can actually be."
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